Town of Natick - Board of Selectmen Minutes

Ms. Evans explained that when the search committee was putting forward candidates’ names, they came to consensus on four candidates. For reasons that had to do with an override vote in his town, one candidate chose to take his name off the table. At 10:00 this morning Richard Montouri announced that for personal reasons he had decided not to pursue the candidacy. Last Friday Philip Lemnios contacted the Town’s consultant, Mark Morse, to check on the process to see if there was any possibility of him putting his name back in. The committee felt strongly when they learned of Mr. Montuori’s withdrawal to put forward three candidates as they were originally going to put forth fourth candidates. The committee voted to put forth Philip Lemnios’ name for consideration.

general manager and worked in Walpole as an assistant town administrator. In both of those towns he received a solid foundation in local government. After Walpole, he branched out and became the town administrator of Millis and has been there since 1991. He was the first town administrator in Millis. When a position was first introduced, there can be some land mines, and he thought it somewhat of an accomplishment to have successfully integrated the position into the town. He works closely with the Planning Board, Conservation Commission, department heads.

Mr. Aspinwall continued that as to his future in Millis, many of the things he has been working on were coming to fruition and he didn’t see the challenge there and was looking for a position in an established residential suburbs similar to Natick. He has talked to people who work in the town and live in Natick and has heard a lot of good things.

Mr. McKinley asked what Mr. Aspinwall saw as the opportunities and challenge in Natick that made Natick a choice. Mr. Aspinwall responded that it was a combination of some financial issues both structurally and internally that were mentioned in the audit. To him the challenge of preserving services in an era where pumping up 2-l/2 was needed was something he would like to continue to work on. Millis has had two operational overrides in the last eight years. He also noted that he has been working on some of the same environmental issues Natick was facing.

Mr. Aspinwall noted that the situation in Natick was analogous to Natick. The downtown area in Millis was ill-defined and to attract businesses to help with the tax burden, it was felt that the downtown needed to be defined. Millis was successful in getting $4 million for the first phase of the Route 109 construction project. Many things have been done to try to create a better downtown – lighting, brick access ways, etc. The second phase was scheduled to be bid in the fall and that was going to build the infrastructure to define the downtown. That has to be followed up with zoning changes and that should come to fruition in the next 4-5 years.

Mr. Ball inquired as to how active a role Mr. Aspinwall took in the override efforts. Mr. Aspinwall responded that he supplied information, attended meetings held by the Board of Selectmen, answered any questions that were asked. The Board of Selectmen took the lead in advocating for it. He wasn’t asked to play a part in advocating it. That was the policymakers.

Mr. Ciccariello asked Mr. Aspinwall to define his management style, and Mr. Aspinwall responded that it was a collaborative team oriented style. He added that he tries to push the decision making process as far down as he can so when problems arise those people can take care of them before they get to him. He supports the employee when he/she makes those decisions. He tries to guide rather than push or pull.

Mr. McKinley asked Mr. Aspinwall to explain his biggest single disappointment or failure in Millis. Mr. Aspinwall responded that he would characterize it as lessons learned. He has been told that he shouldn’t be as hard on employees as on himself. There was one termination he made that after 10 years of experience, he would have given the employee another chance.

Should he be the successful candidate, Mr. Stern noted that Mr. Aspinwall would be coming into a job situation where most, if not all, department heads had been here for a while and had established procedures and ways of doing things. How would he (Mr. Aspinwall) go about integrating his procedures into that framework – weaving a new management style without ruffling feathers?

Mr. Aspinwall responded that he would first need to establish a working relationship with the Board of Selectmen and department heads and employees. He noted that he was not here to be a department head or to do the Board of Selectmen’s job, but to do the town administrator’s job which was the chief administrative officer. He knew the Town had a very good staff and his first few weeks on the job would be to try to establish those relationships and then make judgments on strengths and weaknesses so he knew where to concentrate his efforts.

In response Mr. Aspinwall said that he would like to be able to say that his parents were proud of him. He noted that he had had the benefit of a good education and thought he had a good head on his shoulders. At the conclusion of his career, he would like people to be able to say that he was an honest hard-working guy.

Mr. Aspinwall replied that he would try to work through the superintendent – peer to peer. That was not to say that he wouldn’t provide any information he could to the School Committee, but he would establish a relationship with the superintendent and once that was successfully done, he would work with the superintendent and Board of Selectmen to try to create an atmosphere of understanding. He would help each side understand the need for certain resources and what the impact of not having those resources would be.

Mr. Aspinwall felt that the process they had in Millis had worked very successfully. Each year the Board of Selectmen, beginning early in the fiscal year, outlines its goals for the budget year and he carries that through in the budget process. Once the Board of Selectmen sets its goals and objectives for the year, then specific goals and objectives were assigned to him. There was a certain set of base requirements such as personnel, finance, DPW that he was measured on. At the conclusion of the year he sits down with each Selectman privately and is reviewed by each of them. Later at a public meeting he is reviewed publicly. Mr. Aspinwall added that if the record of success he has had was any indication of future success, by seeing the performance evaluations he has received, he thought he could do well in Natick.

Mr. Hughes asked that Mr. Aspinwall describe his experience and history with labor management issues. Mr. Aspinwall responded that he was responsible for negotiating all contracts along with the department head and one member of the Board of Selectmen. It was a three-man team. They don’t use attorneys and have had a very good relationship with the ASME union. In the early 1990’s there wasn’t a good relationship with the Police but it was something the administration worked on and they established better trust. Last year they settled a three-year contract. In negotiations he urged the Board of Selectmen to look at where Millis stood with its peer communities. They don’t want to be the highest and don’t want to be the lowest. Over the past 5-6 years he has had a very amicable relationship with the unions.

As a follow-up Mr. Hughes asked if Mr. Aspinwall had settled contracts where one ends and the other begins or have there been times when it took 1-2 years in between to settle a contract. Mr. Aspinwall replied that in the 1990’s Millis made two visits to the JLMC, but by the mid 1990’s they had worked out a better relationship and settled contracts before they expired.

Mr. McKinley inquired if the Millis Fire Department was volunteer or full-time, and was told by Mr. Aspinwall that Millis just hired their first two full-time firefighters last year. Plus there was a full-time chief. When asked if he had experience with Fire union contracts, Mr. Aspinwall advised that he did in Walpole.

Mr. Stern noted that the town administrator is required to be accessible by the Board, by the public, by community groups. Natick was a community that fosters involvement and study committees, and Mr. Stern asked where Mr. Aspinwall drew the line on accessibility and how he handles the demands of everyone pulling on at once and where did he say ‘no’.

Mr. Aspinwall responded that his perspective now after having been a town administrator for 11-12 years from when he was an assistant was different. He discovered with experience that we don't know what we are doing all the time. No one was perfect. To foster the goals of the Board for the Town, he would use any resources he could including volunteers and committees. He recognized the value of that and uses

In terms of meetings, Mr. Aspinwall stated that all day and weeknights he was the Town’s. Weekends he tries to be with his family as much as he can although he knew there were times he would be called away. His wife was accustomed to it. There were times that people may show up at his doorstep and he was preparing for meetings and he may have to say that he will talk to them tomorrow or the next day, but he has to get this done now. He was open to talk to people when they pop into the office.

Mr. Ball asked about Mr. Aspinwall’s policy for getting back to citizens and if he had someone screen his calls. Mr. Aspinwall responded that generally he asks the staff to ask what someone is seeking and if he was in the middle of something, he would ask if he could call the person back or have a department head who can better answer the question take the call. If he were not in the middle of something or in an appointment, he would take the call. Staff will say that he will call the person back and he will return the call. Typically he returns all calls by the end of the next day. That was his goal.

Mr. Ciccariello requested that Mr. Aspinwall give an overview of his approach to financial management. Mr. Aspinwall stated that he was fairly conservative and the Town of Millis has been successful because it made conservative decisions. They came off their strongest financial year and certified over $1M in free cash of which he was advocating that a good chunk go into the stabilization fund. When making decisions he always has in mind the future and what effects the decisions will have.

When asked about Millis’ bond rating, Mr. Aspinwall advised that it was A2. He added that he had the DOR look at the bond rating with a view to doing whatever Millis could to improve that rating. Without significant economic development, their bond rating wasn’t going to go up which was one reason for concentrating on the downtown.

Mr. McKinley inquired as to what departments report directly to the town administrator in Millis and how Mr. Aspinwall evaluated the performance of each. Mr. Aspinwall responded that all department heads report directly to him except for the Board of Health, and he uses a similar performance evaluation for them as he had with the Board of Selectmen. He added that he tried not to wait until the end of a year, but to bring in department heads throughout the year and go over the goals.

Mr. Aspinwall responded that he would be looking for someone who can first do what he plans to do – establish effective working relationships. Someone who can work with the Personnel Board and other department heads and be a resource. He had been an assistant town administrator so he knew what was required of the position. Insurance, personnel, contract review were the types of things he did and he would have the deputy concentrate on that.

Having the circumstance of starting the office with a clean administrative slate, Mr. Stern inquired as to what strengths Mr. Aspinwall would be looking for in a deputy. Mr. Aspinwall stated that he would want someone whose strength was in the financial area. In terms of level of responsibility, he generally provided an open atmosphere of working with the department heads. He treated the deputy as a department head and would assign work, monitor, and periodically meet with him.

Mr. Aspinwall advised that Millis had two state reps. He worked closely with Representatives Linsky and Brown who has been effective in getting money for Route 109. Mr. Aspinwall noted that his goal was to use all the resources he could and using the state reps was a big part of that. Representative Linsky went to the MPO meeting to speak on Millis’ behalf and Senator Jacques was involved in getting a water treatment grant.

Mr. Aspinwall explained that he had the title DPW Director. When the town created the town administrator position, it was a selling point to say the town administrator can do the job of DPW Superintendent. He didn’t have any day-to-day operational responsibility. There was an assistant director who does that, but as a project manager he (Mr. Aspinwall) had a strong role with respect to water system development, transfer station compliance. He was involved on an oversight basis. He added that Millis had a tremendous amount of capital improvement, and more than doubled their water supply. When he started Millis had two wells and this year they were building wells 5 and 6. In Natick he would assist on projects, but the day-to-day operation would be left to the department head.

Mr. Aspinwall responded that he enjoys playing basketball. He noted that he was married and had three children ages 13, 10, and 7. His wife was a nurse. His children were in the middle of the sports years and he coached his oldest son’s baseball team. His daughter was very big into Irish step dance and a lot of time was spent going with her. It was a busy household, but they were able to keep it together.

Mr. Stern inquired as to what trait or interaction on the job drove Mr. Aspinwall nuts. Mr. Aspinwall responded that it was when people say they can’t do that. He noted that he had told the search committee that listening was an important thing for him and when he was exploring a problem or an issue and someone says, they can’t do that, they aren’t listening.

Mr. Aspinwall replied that each Selectman he had worked with and worked for, which was about 10-12, has been different. He tried to meet each of their needs. When it comes to a disciplinary action or termination, he didn’t bring it to that level until he had exhausted all options he had and he had to go that way. Terminations can be appealed to the Board of Selectmen or through arbitration and he hadn’t had one overturned. He made sure he did it the right way, but tried his best not to get to that position.

In response to Mr. Ciccariello’s inquiry as to how important Mr. Aspinwall felt the town administrator’s role was in interacting with the Natick business community, Mr. Aspinwall replied that he was not as knowledgeable about the community as the Board. If it was the Board’s call that the Town Administrator get involved in that and get involved in economic development, he would. It was something in which he was interested.

Mr. Aspinwall noted that anytime the Town can regionalize or bundle services to save money, it should be looked at. Millis has a transfer station where people pay $1.25 per bag and he was amazed at how much people recycle because they have to pay. Millis has a really good recycle rate. They went out to bid to run the transfer station and

Mr. Ball wished for financial miracles, noting that Natick had managed for the better part of 20 years to avoid overrides but eventually you run out of smoke and mirrors and has run up against the reality of 2-l/2. He thought finding ways of preserving the services the Town provides to the greatest extent possible without overrides would be his major charge recognizing that an override or a series (of overrides) was going to be on the horizon.

Mr. McKinley identified value management as his priority. He didn’t know if it was possible to avoid overrides in the coming years because there were some revenue factors outside the Town’s control, but there was a certain quality of life that Natick has become accustomed to and he thought the Town had a responsibility to continue to deliver that to the residents and taxpayers. Getting the most for the least was a goal, but it was managing that value level. He wanted to re-enforce how much the Town employees were valued and appreciated and not just at the management level, but the labor unions as well. The past 12 months have been difficult because there has been a vacuum of leadership at the top. He would like to see relationships re-established and employees have a sense of appreciation and stability and rebuild some morale that has eroded away.

Mr. Hughes stated that he wanted all of that (listed by the other members of the Board). He noted that the new town administrator would give the Board a fresh look at the way the Town has been operating and hopefully assure the Board that the Town has been providing services and tax value. He hoped for that fresh look very early on. He also noted that the Board just instituted a single pay trash fee which the Board hoped to change to a pay-as-you throw, and he was looking for the town administrator to be very creative with financial planning in spending and creating the dollars for services.

Mr. Aspinwall told the Board that he thought he could bring to the position a combination of interpersonal skills and a basic in the fundamentals of municipal government. He had experience with the DPW, personnel, negotiating contracts, collective bargaining, legal issues, finances. In addition he thought he could bring a level of strategic thinking to help the Town in future planning. He welcomed knowledge and assistance from volunteers and would look at any idea anyone had. He was very process oriented, and thought he could bring a level of determination that was necessary not just in Natick but in any town administrator position in the Commonwealth. He had a level of credibility and ability to work with others and establish trust in effective relationships. Once the Board knew him, he thought the Board would be able to trust him implicitly.

Mr. McKinley outlined the process the Board hoped to follow in making a selection. The third candidate would be interviewed on May 30th and Mr. Aspinwall was welcome to attend. On June 3 there would be some discussion of the interviews, but the decision would be tabled. During the period of June 3 to June 17, each member of the Board would be contacting the candidates individually to get to know the candidates better. Assuming the process went smoothly, the Board would make a final decision on June 17th. Mr. Hughes added that the Board hoped to have the candidates here (in Natick) between June 3 and June 17 to meet the department heads.

Mr. Dizoglio told the Board that he grew up in Lawrence which was a community that had a heyday, but a lot of things happened and the city deteriorated. He always wanted to improve his community, particularly in economic development. When he got out of school with a masters degree in public administration, he went to work in his hometown as a planner and tried to use his experience to improve his hometown. He was anxious to head his own department and had the opportunity to head the Community Development department in Taunton. It was the first Community Development office Taunton had and it gave him the opportunity to create a department. He was able to attract a number of businesses and created a lot of jobs and put Taunton into an economic revitalization.

Mr. Dizoglio continued that his wife was from Methuen and was homesick so he took a job as the Director of Community Development in Peabody. The Community Development department was restructured and that gave him more responsibility than he ever had. He was in charge of all public buildings and development of all new structures which gave him the opportunity to get involved with building a fire station, a civic center, a senior center, and library. It was a good opportunity for him to expand his responsibilities.

As the mayor, Mr. Dizoglio said he built three schools in Methuen for K-8, doubled the size of the library, repaired the stadium, promoted open space and recreation improvements, reorganized some departments, helped in the transition from the manager form to mayor and he thought it went well, but there were term limits and he had to leave. At that point he was interested in something bigger than where he was and was looking for somewhere where he could take his experience and utilize it in a different fashion. He was able to secure the position of Director of Planning for the MBTA which is the 4th largest transit authority in the country. As Director of Planning he was responsible to do all capital planning for the MBTA which was about $500 million a year. It was his responsibility to identify the projects the MBTA undertakes. He was promoted to the Assistant General Manager for Planning and Real Estate.

Mr. Dizoglio stated that the interest he had in Natick was that for most of his life he has been in municipal government and he liked municipal government. He found it interesting and challenging. Every day there was a new issue to be resolved. While the MBTA was a challenging position, it was very bureaucratic and some times he felt as though he was not challenged as he was on the municipal side. Natick was a stable community with a diverse tax base, and he felt he could bring his experience of 20 years in municipal government to be a consensus builder and ensure the community was a good place to live. His interest was one of sincerity that municipal government was where it’s at. Job satisfaction was something he strived for and he thought a municipal setting would allow him to have the job satisfaction he would like.

Mr. Dizoglio responded that he had thought about that. He was fifty years old and not ready to retire, but he was looking for an opportunity that would allow him to go to a point where he could be challenged and enjoy what he was doing. He was not looking to run for political office again. He was looking for stability and the opportunity to use his experience in a setting he enjoyed until he was ready to retire.

Mr. Ciccariello asked Mr. Dizoglio for an overview of his management style, and Mr. Dizoglio responded that it was a very hands on approach. He was very interested in what’s going on. He had a democratic approach and believed in staff meetings and one of inclusion and democracy, but he was very hands on. He thought it important to be involved in the discussion and decision making process. He was hands on and democratic.

not, adding that he became involved with the real estate department two months ago. TRA was a private entity that had a contract for five years. His involvement now was managing the TRA contract. He couldn’t take any credit for anything good they (TRA) did, but couldn’t take any of the blame only being in charge for two months.

Mr. Stern commented on Mr. DiZoglio’s strong history in economic development and noted that parking was probably the single biggest issue the Town was facing for the downtown. The Town has probably gone as far as it can go without additional parking and the Town was looking for ways to fund that. How did Mr. Dizoglio see approaching that problem?

Mr. Dizoglio responded that he and Sarki (Community Development Director Sarki Sarkisian) talked about the garage and the multiple role it plays. There were a number of different tools that could be utilized. One new one was called an enterprise account. It was not a traditional municipal enterprise fund where all the funds collected were used for a particular purpose. He found when building a garage the revenue collected will not satisfy the debt service, but if there was a subsidy of some amount, it can make a project operate in the black. He and Sarki had talked a little bit about something like that. The other avenue was for the MBTA to build it itself, but then there was competition with the municipality. Mr. Dizoglio added that he thought there was an avenue to fund (a garage) whether it be a public/private partnership, SEMAC funds, PWED funds, community action grants. It would take all those sources and was a matter of mix and match. There were a lot of tools out there and the Town has to explore and see which one was the best and pull them. Parking was out of his department and the major function was to build more.

Mr. Dizoglio replied that he was a firm believer that many times managers don’t have the opportunity to interact with their employees to tell them what they were doing good and what they might improve on. The structure on the municipal side many times doesn’t create that. Some see it as discipline, but it really isn’t. He was able to negotiate creating an incentive for unions to allow for an evaluation so the cost of living would be 3% and if an employee was successfully evaluated, he/she gained another 1%. It was embraced by a majority of the unions, but not by police and fire. He was not able to negotiate that incentive (with police and fire), but included in the contract was a pilot with no money tied to it. Mr. Dizoglio said he thought it important to have that one-on-one discussion so expectations were told to the employee. In the case of police and fire the evaluation didn’t really carry weight, but it created a dynamic that made a better relationship between the officers and management.

Since leaving Methuen, Mr. McKinley asked if Mr. Dizoglio had any knowledge whether the police and fire were still functioning with the performance evaluation. Mr. Dizoglio noted that it (police and fire evaluations) was not like the other unions where they get a percent more. He was not sure if the management was still able to give them

Mr. Hughes asked Mr. Dizoglio to describe what labor management relations were like while he was Mayor of Methuen. Mr. Dizoglio advised that he would meet with the various department heads and talk about management issues they felt needed to be addressed. He came to the table with a series of issues and the unions came with issues. He tried to balance the discussion with management requests and union requests and stepped away from the process. He allowed the solicitor to do the majority of the negotiating along with the department head to deal with the majority of the issues on which there could be an agreement and get to a point where they were at the major issues that couldn’t be resolved. He allowed as much of the negotiation to be done as possible, and he would come in at the end to try to make the deal. He tried to see his role as more of a closer.

Mr. Dizoglio advised that outside of police and fire most were settled on a timely basis. Maybe a few of the smaller unions would stretch on, but the DPW, AFLCIO would negotiate a contract (on time). With police and fire the city went to labor relations a number of times and ended up in mediation on a number of occasions.

Mr. Dizoglio responded that he brought some of the management skills he talked about to the financial table. In his opinion the budget was not recognized as often as it should be as the chief policy document of the community. It was a policy document and he thought it was very important that there be a lot of hands on experience sitting down with the department heads, understanding the request they have made and formulating a budget on a one-on-one transaction as to why they (department heads) want certain things, the history, and seeing how the numbers can be moved around to make it fit. He met with every department head and then made a recommendation based on that transaction that would be presented to the city council and public hearings.

Mr. Dizoglio continued that he monitored the status of appropriations on a regular basis. He believed that you couldn’t do all the nice things you wanted to do for the community unless the financial base was in order. It started with financial planning, fiscal monitoring and direct involvement. If there were strong finances, decisions can be made where you want to take the community.

Noting that Mr. DiZoglio’s resume speak of upgrading the bond rating, Mr. Ciccariello asked what the rating was before and after. Mr. Dizoglio explained that the bond rating increase was for short-term bonds and was now MIG1. The regular bond was an A1 which was what it was when he got there. The upgrade was for short-term borrowing. He

added that Methuen always suffered for it being an older blue collar community. He had a tendency to stay under the levy limit as he thought it was a good safety net. He thought it was important because if the city had an issue where it needed to raise capital, it could get that money. The bond raters like to see cities and towns tax the citizens and put it in reserves. Mr. Dizoglio noted that Methuen was $4 million under the levy limit but was able to build up the stabilization fund. He did upgrade the short-term borrowing and strengthened the A1 status.

Mr. Ball asked if it was fair to say that as mayor Mr. Dizoglio answered only to the electorate. Mr. DiZoglio’s response was, ‘yes’. Mr. Ball then noted that as Director of Community Development Mr. Dizoglio reported to the town administrator, but Mr. Dizoglio clarified that he reported to the mayor. Mr. Ball pointed out that as town administrator in Natick, Mr. Dizoglio would have five bosses and asked if he (Mr. Dizoglio) thought he appreciated the difference working for five part-time elected officials and his prior experience.

Mr. Dizoglio stated that he understood the difference. He acknowledged that it was correct that he responded to the electorate, but he had to respond to the city council on a regular basis and he had a good relationship with them. The MBTA has a Board of Directors and he can’t get his projects funded or implemented without the Board of Directors. In his other positions while the mayor was his supervisor, going to the Planning Board or working with the ZBA was not foreign to him. He stated that he wouldn’t even suggest to be the mayor of Natick. The relationship between the Board of Selectmen and Town Administrator needs to be a good one and he would look to the Board of Selectmen to set the policy. It was the administrator’s job to put together a strategy to get where the Board wants the community to go. Mr. Dizoglio told the Board that he would not feel uncomfortable with five part-time elected officials and he didn’t think there would be any problems or concerns with him understanding his role.

Mr. Dizoglio felt it was difficult to say what all the responsibilities of the deputy would be. In the past the deputy was involved in personnel and labor. There doesn’t seem to be a central purchasing area and perhaps that could be a responsibility. Those were the kinds of things he had been hearing in talking with people. He would be looking for someone who likes municipal government and was interested in municipal government. Someone who was interested in making things happen was conscientious and hard working. His Assistant Deputy Director (at the MBTA) was someone who complemented his skills, and he wanted someone to make sure all the ‘i’s were dotted and ‘t’s crossed. It was the supportive skills that would be helpful in making sure that when things were implemented, they were done right.

Mr. Dizoglio responded that he believed that classification was created not for a tax break but to be able to deal with the reval every three years when there could be a shift in the burden between residential and commercial. He tried not to play politics with it, and did not adjust the classification rate until there was a reval because if residential was going up 10% and commercial only going up 5%, there could be a shift in the tax burden and then he would look to see if he could balance it to make sure everybody was getting the same kind of hit on the taxes. He used it as he thought it was intended if there was a big burden shift.

As to the role he would play, it would be to show the Board what impact it would have to offset a reval with a significant shift so the Board could determine whether it wants to try to make some parity or wants to continue taxing a flat rate. He would suggest it be in the context of a reval and the impact on the values of residential vs commercial looked at.

In his role as a mayor, Mr. McKinley inquired as to who determined Mr. DiZoglio’s objectives. Mr. Dizoglio responded that in his own projects, it was a matter of talking with the folks in the community. He noted that when he came on board (in Methuen), he visited the superintendent of schools and asked his perception of where the schools were and where he wanted to go. The superintendent said he had to decide on the middle school concept and deal with redistricting. The superintendent’s concerns resulted in him (Mr. Dizoglio) saying that he would fund l/2 and the schools fund l/2 to do an analysis of what they thought the growth would be, what kind of numbers would be needed to see whether a K-8 system met the concerns outlined. A firm was hired and once the work was completed, it gave them a picture as to where they wanted to go. They recognized the school age population would increase by l,000 over 10 years and they needed to expand classrooms. Once the goal was determined, it was a matter of working with the council to get the bond authorized. He got the idea by talking with folks whether it be municipal folks or citizens that said a library was needed that was twice the size.

were citizens. He would participate in some of the organizations they may have. He thought it important for the businesses not to feel they were not part of community because they don’t live here. They were part of the community. They employ people and pay taxes. To him having access for the business community was a key element and would address their issues in context with the other objectives of the community.

Mr. Dizoglio noted that while he said hands on, he was a firm believer in delegating. Managers needed to be given the ability to get the job done. Hands on was understanding the big picture side of it – understanding the problems and the political sensitivity. It was not micro-managing, but talking to department heads and discussing choices. If he agreed with the choice, then he would say implement it otherwise he would say why not wait. It was the timing.

As a mayor, town administrator, or CEO, Mr. Stern asked Mr. Dizoglio what personality trait in his staff drove him over the wall. Mr. DiZoglio’s response was people who give excuses about everything - people who tell you all the reasons why they can’t do something. He would rather have someone tell him the problems and ask for his advice than say ‘I can’t do it’. He knew that a lot of issues were complex and difficult, but when someone gets to be a manager, they are expected to make things happen and get the job done and giving him excuses didn’t get the job done.

Mr. Dizoglio responded that the mayor was the best job he had. His biggest accomplishment was on the mayor side and what he was able to accomplish in setting the framework for the future of Methuen. Methuen changed their entire form of government and being able to work through that change and at the same time set a very aggressive agenda for bringing the community into the 21st century was something of which he was proud. All of the K-7 facilities were built in the 1990’s and being able to do that on the backdrop of a change in government, he believed improved people’s confidence in government.

As to his biggest disappointment, Mr. Dizoglio noted that in his last two years (as mayor) he had a situation where he was a lame duck and couldn’t run for re-election. The city council had term limits as well and were lame ducks. There were a number of people running for mayor. It was a Hatfield’s and McCoy’s situation, and he felt for the last couple of years that he wasn’t able to move forward and was just maintaining until the next group came in. He noted that he always thought he would write a book on how term limits or lame ducks prevent government from moving forward. That last two years was frustrating in not being able to continue the progress and just maintaining.

did not like. The rates were going up and the trust fund was in the red. As the private sector had pushed them into this mess having had John Hancock for three years, he decided why not see what the private sector would do if the city went out to bid. While preparing to go out to bid, he started to ask questions about how to manage the stop loss and he was hearing that others weren’t paying $325,000 for stop loss. There was a significant savings that could be had there, and he separated it and got a preferred provider network to improve the cost. He got Tufts and saved money on administrative costs. They went out to bid on stop loss and saved over $200,000. That encouraged him to take a look at the aggregate stop loss and it gave them an opportunity to assess where they were and get a hands on understanding of the marketplace.

Mr. Dizoglio continued that he was also able to get a Blue Cross product. There was concern that the young people would jump into the HMO, and he agreed to allow Blue Cross Elect to come in but he kept the premium the same so there was no incentive for the young to leave. He had used the private sector to get another contractor on board, went out to bid, and looked at the stop loss.

Mr. Dizoglio pointed out that a lot of the health care costs were being driven by retirees and he tried to encourage them to leave the program and go to a Secure Horizons. He suggested doing something like the banks and offering them free toasters. He was looking for ways like that to manage. It was a management issue. Mr. Dizoglio said he knew Natick was part of a consortium and the consortium would look over that to make sure it went out to bid, what the deductible was, and make sure the cost savings were maximized.

Mr. Ciccariello commented that Mr. Dizoglio seemed to be full of energy and asked how he drew the line between his public and private life. Mr. Dizoglio responded that he was a big tennis player. Tennis allows him to wind down. He also has two daughters age 20 and 17. That was where you leave the town administrator. You have a family and something to release the stress.

Mr. Ball inquired, if in his capacity as mayor, Mr. Dizoglio had had an occasion to fire people and if so how many and under what circumstances. Mr. Dizoglio advised that he had fired people, but it was not an easy thing to do. He had done it more than he would like to talk about, but it was part of the job and you have to get the job done and make sure you have a group of people who can get the job done.

Mr. Dizoglio used the example of a Treasurer who he didn’t think was on top of his game, and he (Mr. Dizoglio) let him go and hired somebody who had a similar position who he thought had the demeanor to get the job done. He found out that person didn’t fit in, wasn’t communicating, and was not sharing the information needed to make management decisions. After two months he fired him. He thought it was important that that person not hurt the community. Mr. Dizoglio acknowledged that maybe he made a mistake in hiring him, but when you deal with someone on a day-to-day basis, you can get a feel for him.

As the Town’s CEO, Mr. Stern asked if Mr. Dizoglio envisioned himself having an open door policy and drop ins. How accessible would he be to the man on the street? Mr. Dizoglio responded that he used to say he had an open door policy and did that by keeping the door open if there was no meeting going on. He did that to show people he was accessible. He believed this was their government and their community and they should have access to people who were trying to work with them to make the community a better place. He liked people and he liked interaction.

As the mayor, Mr. McKinley inquired as to whom gave Mr. Dizoglio his raises and how was the amount determined. Mr. Dizoglio advised that it was the city council and they gave him one raise. When asked if they (city council) were not pleased with his performance, Mr. Dizoglio responded that he didn’t think it was that and went on to explain that when Methuen was under the Town Manager form, they were paying $75,000-80,000. When the city went to the mayor form, they said one person can be both the Chief Administrative Officer and the Chief Elected Official and for the extra responsibility, they reduced the salary by $20,000. When he came there as mayor, the salary was low and he thought the feeling was that it was the first time having a mayor and they didn’t know what kind of candidates they would get. After two years, he was given a $10,000 raise. He didn’t think there was dissatisfaction with him. They were trying to understand where it should be in the scheme of things. It was his feeling that the city would attract better candidates if they paid more, but he thought they were wrestling with going from a town manager to a mayor.

Mr. Dizoglio responded that some of the staff he had saw it as a little autocratic, but added that he would ask for a recommendation and if he thought it was a good idea, he would say go ahead. If he was concerned about it, he would say let’s wait. The town administrator does have to make the decision in the end. With the Board of Selectmen, it was not that kind of relationship. It’s more of a consensus building. He added that in getting up to that decision, there was a lot of input and a lot of discussion.

Mr. Stern asked about the driving time from Methuen to Natick and was told by Mr. Dizoglio that it was 42 miles from front door to front door. Currently he drives 32 miles. Mr. Stern commented that that makes for a long day with the amount of time in the office and how did Mr. Dizoglio see handling that extra time in terms of the commute.